Bring numbers. Anecdotally I only have information to the contrary. The buffs bm brings are easily replaced and at the moment I personally see no reason to respec. Even though I miss my Dino (and several raid members request to see “Gaylord” the giant pink Devilsaur come stomping back).

oh well, i guess i can show off my red green christmas stompy thing in yogg then

Currently by every test – from theorycraft to target dummies to in-game raid testing – BM falls behind SV and MM. And yes, of course I test with appropriate glyphs and gems (the reason I’m always so broke, because I do a *lot* of testing). In almost every boss fight, the only way that BM outperforms if if their gear or skill is higher than the SV/MM (and, in general, gear and skill always wins out). With equal skill, MM/SV is just a higher damage spec.

If you have data that contradicts this, I encourage you to post that data. We love the scientific process here, which includes constantly challenging conclusions with new data! However, before you post, remember: “The plural of anecdote is not data.”

“Certainly some BM hunters can even out dps their MM or SV guildmates – but that’s a clear case of guildmates who aren’t skilled at their spec. It’s not that BM is competetive, but that the other specs are being played poorly (sorry BM hunters!). ”

I’m trying to understand if you posted that because you want a great debate or if you wanted to rile some players or if you truly haven’t got a clue.

First of all some background, been playing since Reign of Chaos, was happily running with my hunter since launch of the MMORPG wow and since then been in the realms top 5 everytime I’ve hit capped level. My raid spec of choice is a BM. I raid with my guildmates who happen to be the rest of the top5 on the realm and some days I come out on top others I don’t but I have never been lower then roughly 800 dps (my gear score is 2875 at time of post.) Would you like me to give you their email address so you can happily tell them they are playing poorly? because trust me when I say they would love it.

How long did you try BM for? When you change specs, did you gem and glyph properly or did you just leave your SV gemmed/glyphed self and thought you could smash out a few recount rounds and compare? Did you proc your wolf and devilsaur at the same time? Where you even geared towards a BM instead of SV? To be fair to us BM out there why don’t you post your charts on this extensive test that left you believing my spec is a non raid spec and even though you didn’t come right out and say it I left me feeling you felt that anyone who does raid as a BM is either a massive tool for letting their raid down or a idiot.

Yes I agree if you get a nub BM and a nub SV the SV is going to come out top dps because let’s face it SV spec is the vanity spec for those who think if they’re top of the recount they have done their job. Raiding is so much more then just see boss, shoot boss.

For the love of all that is right, if you’re going to dis my spec as well as – well at least on my realm – 1,364 other lvl80 BM hunters. Please either dedicate more time to know the spec before writing it off or admit you just don’t want to because you feel safer as a SV.

Regards,

There are absolutely one or two boss fights atm that favor BM. And there are intricacies to BM beyond just spamming steady shot; however, BM is significantly less dps than an equivalently skilled and geared MM or SV hunter at the moment. And I’m sorry, but BM is just an easier spec (though on a couple of bosses, it can be very hard indeed).

Yes, any dpser will outperform a dpser on orb duty. And I’d argue that BM is a worse spec for orb duty because they have fewer instant shots and are less likely to one or two shot an orb.

And let’s be clear: enrage timers are hit by raids with insufficient dps. Regardless of why their dps is insufficient, the solution is to do more dps.

Enrage timers are only hit by guilds who aren’t ready to down the boss yet. It’s not because one person is doing 1000 fewer DPS, it’s because the raid as a whole isn’t performing well enough. You can’t blame one person for a few seconds of timer loss, especially if they’re giving the raid 3% damage that more than makes up for their loss in DPS. Hunters do awful DPS anyway compared to the other pures and even several hybrids, there is a reason the top guilds don’t use them at all on hard modes.

I think you should do more tests and try to really understand the BM spec you look down on so much. A great BM hunter can match or beat a good MM/SV hunter. There are a lot of intricacies, that most players would overlook, that make BM easily the most difficult spec to play. I see BM hunters doing 8k DPS average throughout a raid night, while their MM friends are only doing 7800. Let me guess, 7800 is terrible DPS and the MM hunter must be a huge retard.

Also, you want a mix of classes to get all the different buffs.