I don’t generally like to just repost a blue post without a discussion behind it, but in this case that’s pretty much what I’m doing. This is just nice news to hear:
Hunter dps was where we wanted it to be in Naxx. Two problems arose in the Ulduar tier. First, we improved the dps of other pure classes, especially rogues. We have a small change coming up that should slightly improve hunter dps to make up for this and will apply to all level 80 hunters. (But do not assume you are going to see a 20% dps jump when we make this change.)
The second problem is that in order for hunter dps to improve, they must upgrade their bow and arrows. A rogue by contrast needs two weapons and a Ret paladin one weapon. However, a higher tier of arrows was not available anywhere. Because dropping arrows as loot feels cruddy, we handled this in the past through a rep grind. We can’t just give the arrows away to fresh level 80s or hunter dps will be too high relative to other classes. Long term, we have a different solution for arrows, but that won’t help in Ulduar. So the change we made was to let bows (and guns) scale more than other weapons to make up for the “missing” ammo. The ammo is baked in to the weapon damage.
We didn’t think this was a problem for the 10-player case because the melee and casters are not getting weapons with such large stat increases. The Ulduar 10 loot is slightly better than the Naxx 25 loot, but only slightly (it depends a lot on how many 226 items you were able to get). Since we said Naxx 25 wasn’t a problem (in our eyes), Ulduar 10 isn’t a problem either. (If you think your Naxx damage was too low I can understand how you might feel differently, but that is not our position.)
Players have a tendency to sometimes invoke “scaling problems” as a generic explanation for why they need buffs. However, in this case it was truly 100% a scaling problem. Scaling problems only happen when characters acquire better and better gear — literally as gear stats increase, some classes might not be benefiting as much as others so balance at one tier goes away at higher tiers. The weapons in Ulduar 25 with their relatively large stat increases had this problem. The weapons in Ulduar 10 with their slight or null stat increases did not (though they will in the next tier of content, as will the Ulduar 10 hard mode weapons).
I know that many of our 10-man only hunter members are disappointed that they aren’t going to see the gun scaling, but it’s very nice to hear that yes, scaling is a problem. Yes, all those theorycrafters who predicted it in 3.0 were right, and yes, we are doing something about it. (And theoretically somewhat soon.)
I am curious to see what this boost is, however. They’ve already done the gun thing as a way of giving the boost only to higher end hunters. And now they’re talking about a small change that will apply to all level 80 hunters. What could it be? A new built-in mechanic, like all hunters get 2% armor pen automatically? A boost to aspect of the dragonhawk? I gotta say, from the phrasing, it doesn’t sound like it’s going to be something related to a shot or a spell or a talent. Unless it’s a new spell. Boosting our default haste? Giving us an “I Win” button that automatically kills all non-hunters on the server?
Hmm…

Funny … I felt like I was falling further behind in the 10-Ulduar than in the 25-man raids where I got more inter-class buffage …
Regardless … any buff is a good buff as long as the gnomes can’t get it.
As a Beastmaster, we still want to do a bit more for our pets (and Blue is looking to improve BMs). Shandy still wants to wear armor. But that’s a slippery slope to start upon.
If you give a bear some armor, she’s going to ask for a cestus.
When you give her the cestus, she’ll probably ask to have some of the straps custom-fit.
When she’s finished, she’ll ask to try them on some real targets.
Then she will want to look in a mirror to make sure she doesn’t have blood stains.
When she looks into the mirror, she might notice that her fur needs a trim. So she will probably ask for some scissors…
Honestly I think the easy way to fix BM that will continue to work as gear improves is, alas, just to increase their pet dps. Allow your pet to gain some percentage of our armor pen, haste, crit, etc. Now, this change would boost all hunter pets, but boost BM pets dramatically more.
Actually, if done carefully, that could fix everything right there.
The only thing that concerns me is that when we get one buff the devs think they have overdone it and BAM we get hit with the nerfhammer once again. I know that BM was insane in naxx but that was when all we did was AoE pulls all night and by the end of a raid my Volley button was wore out. Now that we are getting back to strategy and CCing mobs in a raid setting i think BM would have just fine as is and Surv wouldnt be the end all be all spec for anyone to get into a raid.
i thought like i was falling behind in 10m ulduar to. i just got avalanche from 10m hodir, but it feels like a bit of a lateral move from nerubian conqueror. im marks, and mana is pissing me off lol tho i did finally start utilizing viper sting and its nice when its usable.
i must be the only hunter that doesnt really care for the pet mechanic. it feels like to much of a liability. i bring a wolf for its howl. pet dying wasnt a problem in most of naxx, buti have had mine die in mosts ulduar fights. i guess thats why i never cared for BM, even with all the extra pet survivability it has. i like being in full control, and constantly having to bring my back so it would get pwnt by a flame wave in OS gets old
wow my last sentenced was fail. let me try that again.
“i like being in full control, and constantly having to bring my pet back so it wouldnt get pwnt by the flame wave in OS gets old”
I became a Hunter BECAUSE of the pet mechanic. I miss BM.
/cry
Perhaps they’ll make haste affect the global cooldown.
The fact that the blue post only emphasizes a minor buff to “level 80 hunters” makes me wonder if its not another pet spell like “Kill Command” or if they’ll finally let us launch other traps at range like our CC ice trap. Would it be a benefit to most hunters to give us another ranged AOE if its on the same cooldown as Black Arrow though?
All I know is that I’m not expecting anything “new” or “original” from Blizz (damn, I’d love to see a pet collar or gear for my pet though). In that vein, I think the ammo change that blue has eluded to is going to be something we’ve already seen. A switch to the thrown weapon system for our ammo or Bow/guns are going to generate ammo when we right click on them (like the epic bow in the final Tempest Keep fight).
i never quite understood why hunters have mana. i know a few shots have some magical names and i suppose some traps have “magical” effect, but a lot are just mere tactics and mechanics a hunter or ranger would use. marking a target, steadying our shot, aiming our shot (youd assume all would be aimed but alas)… things youd expect a person of the forest and field to do anyway. if tracking was truly magical, a mage or druid could do as much as we could. id like to see abilities and names tailored more for the concept of our class that didnt require magics, such as something called “blood of the kill” that did something not lame.
im not sure how systems like energy would compliment hunters in practice, but i know in name, it fits better than mana imo. (or maybe im just peeved about the dps i lose constantly having to flip into viper lol)
Quivering…..I COULD NOT AGREE MORE!
I never really thought about it. Guess it doesn’t bother me about mana. A pet collar would be awesome, however.
I think we just have to try and be happy no matter what they give us it will never seem enough, I am however really glad i changed to duel Spec since my Beast Master just was not doing the required damage however Survialist seems to add another 200-300 DPS which really counts i dont think i will ever get to go back back to BM as i can not see Blizzard doing enough to make this spec work like it should.
If we have seen anything with hunter specs over the last year or so, it is that Blizz will keep trying to balance them and in the process just create a kind of slow rotation between them as one tops out the others. This is OK, but I really think Frost (or someone back in the mists of previous posts) got it right that pure DPS classes should have about a 5% damage advantage over the hybrid classes (if played correctly, of course). If that were the the case, I’d be willing to toy around with specs after each patch so long as I was fairly confident that it would always be coming out ahead of druids, shamans, etc.
quivering as an mm using the viper sting do u see a dps increase from not having to switch into AotV as much?
to nascair:
absolutely, does it help. i despise AotV in boss fights cuz it neuters my dps (at least my overall dps for that fight as recount shows it. real time dps tells a different, albeit ever changing story).
using viper sting for me means something else to keep up with, but its a glad trade off. depending on kill order, i have the sting going on a mana mob as often as i can as early as i can (just in case the caster is first to die).
i havent gotten to mess much with it in ulduar yet, and i dont know how dps would fair if i used a viper on a caster boss with chimera occasionally.
overall, if i have a mana target, i go out of my way to put viper on it. its not perfect but it sure does help me, and helps me stay out of aspect.